SWGEmu - 1.0 and the future of JTL

[zimbab]

I'm mostly happy with this change tbh... New server and new rules, moving away from that strict 14.1 will do swgemu a lot of good... Hopefully other servers that have been running additional content could pitch in and we can finally move on and get something we all have been waiting and craving for... I'm not gonna lie, I've been playing on another server for last few months... Was there from start with bunch of new content and its been a breath of fresh air so to say... I still jump on bas from time to time, but so much toxicity allowed by some people, unbalanced stuff, abused system is judt major turn off, I have 2 private servers that I host for my self, to test out code, and just mess around so I'm still dedicated, just not so much anymore to play on basilisk due to all I said... Hopefully suncrusher will change that when that time comes ps! Got nothing bad to say about our devs, just keep on pushing... Many of us still support you and would gladly help in any way we can swg forever

[xirad]

Well put Vlada. And come on folks, who in their right mind would see the devs as bad guys???? Seriously! Without the dedication of their skills and countless years spent doing this for free we would have NOTHING but memories. We have a nearly fully playable game sans JTL. I always think it's interesting when Bas is referred to as alpha. I have been playing like I did on Live sans some features for YEARS now. And I think that's where some folks forget that this game is still being actively developed despite it feeling so damn solid and complete!

Yes, I loved JTL back in the day and spent probably 50% of my time in space. But you can see from my profile I've had an account with the EMU since 2008 and have played off/on over the last decade. It's been nothing short of amazing how far along the game has come from those early days and I'm still astounded the dedication the Team (and I mean everyone, from the devs to the QAs to the CSRs to the forum moderators) has had still after all these years.

I as well would rather have 1.0/Suncrusher and a brand new fresh start for everyone sooner rather than later and if it means a delay to JTL, so be it. There are other space games right now to get your Space-On and I believe when JTL comes we'll still be impressed with how well the graphics and gameplay have held up over the years.

So to the entire SWGEMU Team, I say thank you for keeping the dream alive and letting me escape the daily grind of reality to continue my virtual life in the SWG universe, the universe I fell in love with waaaaay back in that summer of 2004!

Xir

P.s. Just have a look what has been implemented!

https://www.swgemu.com/forums/showthread.php?t=75

[Walking carpet]

Im sorry If I upset anyone but I just cant believe whats happening and very disappointed,cause maybe some players love the ground game 80% to JTL but my game was space 80% and highly PvP so you can understand my downfall

Like I said I dont mind you releasing the ground game before JTL but
with all that been said i estimate the chances of getting JTL to be 20%
am I right? if not what percentage would you estimate LK ?

[Bulba]

1) Expressing disappointment is not the same thing as complaining.
2) JTL wasn't 15% of the game for everyone.
3) There are already new servers with imbalance fixes, new content, and all that good stuff.
4) Nobody is ungrateful or unaware of the scale of the task the devs have already accomplished.

We each have different priorities and interests. E.g I only created an account here because I wanted to play JTL again. I have very little interest in the ground game beyond mining resources that I can use for Shipwright. I accept that is a minority position and I have no problem waiting for JTL to come after everything else. That's what we were told from the beginning.

But it is disappointing to learn that the server architecture needs such radical changes and specialized expertise to even get a prototype running. That's not a comment or reflection on the dedication or skill or any aspect of the development team. And it's not an ungrateful demand.

My understanding was that the packet structures had been reverse engineered years ago, that we had basically all of the information required, and it was a matter of manpower to get to the finish line once the ground features had been done. I thought the fundamentals were in place or at least understood well enough to keep chipping away at the task. I thought there was good potential for progress. And that's partly because the public info looked more promising than what we're now learning.

I don't want to be put into the category of an ungrateful complainer by people who can take or leave the JTL experience. Speak for yourselves because you're not speaking for me. Don't try and create this idea that people who are disappointed should put up or shut up, that they don't know what they're talking about, or that they're upset with the development team. I can be disappointed without being any of those other things.

[Hedge15]

Who knows when we would have found out about this if someone hadn't randomly asked about JTL on the development forum last week.

[lordkator]

Who knows when we would have found out about this if someone hadn't randomly asked about JTL on the development forum last week.

The random questions come all the time, don't be so negative, what would be our motive to keep these things from you? Like there is some stock we can buy without you knowing that will go down the day you know?

No, we've been debating on how to talk about the path forward. And to be direct, I was hoping to write some articles about where we are headed and just haven't had the time. So it's my fault more than anyone else's. This question just hit me at the right time, I won't go into the details but I have been deeply reflective on the time I spend on this project, trying to think about where I want to go with my time, and this question just hit me right in the chest.

Let us not attribute to malice and cruelty what may be referred to less criminal motives.

I wish more people here would stop trying to read all sorts of BS into our actions, we're all humans, busy and we have a lot going on, and the little bit of time we can donate to the project we don't want to waste on the forums writing for hours a day.

My one answer has cost me literally 5 hours I could have been doing other things, with my wife, my family, the project. At this rate I can spend every day writing to you all and never get anything done on the project.

If it were your choice, which would it be?

[Hedge15]

Who knows when we would have found out about this if someone hadn't randomly asked about JTL on the development forum last week.

The random questions come all the time, don't be so negative, what would be our motive to keep these things from you? Like there is some stock we can buy without you knowing that will go down the day you know?

Yes, that's ridiculous, that's why I was wondering. It seems like it's been under wraps for a while.

No, we've been debating on how to talk about the path forward. And to be direct, I was hoping to write some articles about where we are headed and just haven't had the time. So it's my fault more than anyone else's. This question just hit me at the right time, I won't go into the details but I have been deeply reflective on the time I spend on this project, trying to think about where I want to go with my time, and this question just hit me right in the chest.



I wish more people here would stop trying to read all sorts of BS into our actions, we're all humans, busy and we have a lot going on, and the little bit of time we can donate to the project we don't want to waste on the forums writing for hours a day.

My one answer has cost me literally 5 hours I could have been doing other things, with my wife, my family, the project. At this rate I can spend every day writing to you all and never get anything done on the project.

If it were your choice, which would it be?

The one you've made. I just hope it would have been clear to me I should let people know as soon as I'd made it, or even when I started to seriously consider it. We all know now, so that's that.

[fightoo]

I don't post much here but I read up on developments all the time. I play on the awakening server and I have played here.
Attacking the devs is outrageous and utterly pathetic . What they have achieved here is nothing short of incredible. I thought this was a pipe dream and we would never have what we have right now. I'm disappointed about JTL but that's the way it goes.
Thank you from the bottom of my heart for what you have done to this point.

[Hakry]

I do not often post on the forums, however I just want to take a quick moment to thank those of you who are being level headed and taking the time to read the posts from the Developers as well as other Staff and recognize that this decision was well thought out with a good bit of wisdom and experience behind it.


Like Vlada said, think of the great things that could be in the future for the project and projected post 1.0 server, when the times come for it.

[everetth]

Good choice that you guys are deciding to release Suncrusher without Jump to Lightspeed. Makes logical sense since it could take 5+ years to finish JTL. I don't currently play SWG. But I look forward to the release of Suncrusher in a year or two hopefully. Thank you for all your dedication and work.

[Lorrianna]

I do not often post on the forums, however I just want to take a quick moment to thank those of you who are being level headed and taking the time to read the posts from the Developers as well as other Staff and recognize that this decision was well thought out with a good bit of wisdom and experience behind it.


Like Vlada said, think of the great things that could be in the future for the project and projected post 1.0 server, when the times come for it.

My full support to the Dev Team and all the Staff on how this constraint has been evaluated, the decision made and communicated.

Like LordKator and others, I'm also a professional in the technology field on the strategy, portfolio & governance side.

These are the types of difficult decisions that people in technical and leadership roles...especially those who are ultimately accountable for the outcomes... have to make constantly.

What matters is how you handle them.

What Vlada, LordKator, Miztah, and Hakry are pointing out is how they're handling the Cost of Delay delivering 1.0

Cost of Delay is professional way of evaluating and communicating the impact of TIME on the OUTCOMES we hope to achieve by balancing tradeoffs in product.

We use this because it provides the most objective & balanced way of dealing with these tradeoffs in product management.

These volunteers are using professional ways of prioritization and decision making to achieve the outcomes we're all passionate about, because we're fortunate to have some professional in product development & management among them.

I think we can all be clear in our understanding.

• The Dev Team are NOT say "no" to JTL
• Let's not delay 1.0 because of the unique challenge of JTL resulting from decisions made by SOE/LA
• They've invited those with the passion, specific expertise at the right level, and time commitment to learn the Core3 environment and codebase to STEP UP if they want to contribute toward JTL as a feature release following 1.

[lordkator]

I think there is a 100% chance we can have JTL, but the only way it happens is if we get devs who are passionate about it and want to commit their spare time to advancing the code.

Let me share a thought with everyone that I often share with people I'm mentoring. There is one resource every one of us gets every day, and we lose when we go to bed that night: Time. It's the same for everyone, kids to billionaires. If that's true, then, in reality, the most valuable asset you have to bring to the world is Time. How you use that Time is up to you, maybe you play computer games, perhaps you code, maybe you walk your dog, spend it reading a good book or just snuggling with your loved one. Let's get real; this project is a passion project, it's a time suck, for the players it is a massive time sink, and for the developers, it's the same if not worse. We code on the game so much most of us never get to play anymore. And we write the code that is the game, the mechanics of the game become less magical because we know the code. It's hard to stay motivated to play a game where the magic is gone; meanwhile, the SO (wife, girlfriend, boyfriend, dog, cat) stares at the back of your head for countless hours wondering WTF you're doing.

I think it's hard for people to understand, but think of this, why do our devs (including myself) spend so much time here? We don't get paid, in general, we get lambasted on the forums, and people are always convinced we're corrupt and playing on dev island somewhere having fun without you all. All of us have different reasons, but some common themes are we are passionate about this game, we enjoyed it so much we want to share it with others. We also love to learn new things and to push ourselves to do something great lots of people can enjoy. But every one of us has to pay our bills, and we have friends, family, loved ones around us who would like to spend time with us doing things together.

The JTL decision is not about technology, it is literally about Time. Time until we can start innovating and being passionate about our work again. Time until we can create new things the community can play with and enjoy. Time to spend with our loved ones playing the game we want to play because we just committed a new quest or whatever and want to play with it and share it. Or we can spend that Time writing more code in the dark for JTL, with everyone complaining about how the project is stagnant and why don't we have x, y or z implemented and why do we let people camp this mob or that. Remember also this "quest" for JTL for us would mean many moons in a dark room, we can't release it incrementally, it'll be long periods of getting lots of systems working and then we can try releasing some test versions that people can use and test. It would be another year before that might happen at the current commit levels of our dev team and at the expense of getting the ground game done. Hence we decided it was time to move on, to finish the ground game and get to a place where we, the developers, are excited again and use that passion to implement new ideas and have the community enjoy those things.

Passion and Time: The fuel that makes this project move forward!

PS: I spent 1.75 hours today on the forums (I got up at 6am, it's 7:44am), is that really how you want me spending my Time on this project?

[zimbab]

I think there is a 100% chance we can have JTL, but the only way it happens is if we get devs who are passionate about it and want to commit their spare time to advancing the code.

Let me share a thought with everyone that I often share with people I'm mentoring. There is one resource every one of us gets every day, and we lose when we go to bed that night: Time. It's the same for everyone, kids to billionaires. If that's true, then, in reality, the most valuable asset you have to bring to the world is Time. How you use that Time is up to you, maybe you play computer games, perhaps you code, maybe you walk your dog, spend it reading a good book or just snuggling with your loved one. Let's get real; this project is a passion project, it's a time suck, for the players it is a massive time sink, and for the developers, it's the same if not worse. We code on the game so much most of us never get to play anymore. And we write the code that is the game, the mechanics of the game become less magical because we know the code. It's hard to stay motivated to play a game where the magic is gone; meanwhile, the SO (wife, girlfriend, boyfriend, dog, cat) stares at the back of your head for countless hours wondering WTF you're doing.

I think it's hard for people to understand, but think of this, why do our devs (including myself) spend so much time here? We don't get paid, in general, we get lambasted on the forums, and people are always convinced we're corrupt and playing on dev island somewhere having fun without you all. All of us have different reasons, but some common themes are we are passionate about this game, we enjoyed it so much we want to share it with others. We also love to learn new things and to push ourselves to do something great lots of people can enjoy. But every one of us has to pay our bills, and we have friends, family, loved ones around us who would like to spend time with us doing things together.

The JTL decision is not about technology, it is literally about Time. Time until we can start innovating and being passionate about our work again. Time until we can create new things the community can play with and enjoy. Time to spend with our loved ones playing the game we want to play because we just committed a new quest or whatever and want to play with it and share it. Or we can spend that Time writing more code in the dark for JTL, with everyone complaining about how the project is stagnant and why don't we have x, y or z implemented and why do we let people camp this mob or that. Remember also this "quest" for JTL for us would mean many moons in a dark room, we can't release it incrementally, it'll be long periods of getting lots of systems working and then we can try releasing some test versions that people can use and test. It would be another year before that might happen at the current commit levels of our dev team and at the expense of getting the ground game done. Hence we decided it was time to move on, to finish the ground game and get to a place where we, the developers, are excited again and use that passion to implement new ideas and have the community enjoy those things.

Passion and Time: The fuel that makes this project move forward!

PS: I spent 1.75 hours today on the forums (I got up at 6am, it's 7:44am), is that really how you want me spending my Time on this project?

Less forum reading/writing bud and lets start to cracking those Bio Engineer fixes

[lordkator]

Less forum reading/writing bud and lets start to cracking those Bio Engineer fixes

LOL See now you got it! Sadly already burned all my free time, off to the honey do's for the day off...

[zimbab]

LOL See now you got it! Sadly already burned all my free time, off to the honey do's for the day off...

hehehe aight bud have a good one